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Even the guy (Andy Haines) who came up with the term FPGA didn't want to see reconfigurable computing pegged into comp.arch.fpga. It is not the right hierarchy and we should change it and make it right. (its the engineer in me:-) comp.arch.rpu.hardware comp.arch.rpu.software comp.arch.rpu.research The RPU is going to be easy to get people to understand. "Reconfigurable Processing Unit" tells you it is for processing whereas fpga tells you its for gate arraying. I would rather not have to go to any more parties and try to explain "gate arrays." RPUs are processors that can change their internal sturcture on demand. -- Steve Casselman, President Virtual Computer Corporation http://www.vcc.comArticle: 6626
>A hot air gun is cheaper, and won't leave you with some questionable >alloy on the pads. I loop some non-insulated wire (26 AWG) under the >pads of the device, and hold up the board by the wire. When the chip >gets hot enough, it will come off without board damage. I would be wary of using hot air to remove any thin package, e.g. TSOP or TQFP. This is because after a few weeks in the open, these absorb sufficient moisture to *probably* crack the package (or the silicon) if rapidly heated to the solder melting point. This is why these packages must be reflow soldered within a few hours of opening the sealed bad. I have learnt this the hard way, having once seen a 50% failure on Xicor 28C256 TSOP devices, and others too. Hand-soldered ones were 100% fine. But if you just want to remove a chip without wanting to re-use it, hot air is fine. Peter. Return address is invalid to help stop junk mail. E-mail replies to z80@digiserve.com.Article: 6627
hi hans, we got the ds 3.1 working just fine under nt 4.0; it did take a bit of messing (and cussin') to get the object store server running correctly. the workview office 7.2 loaded fine but we haven't run it yet over there (slow migrating). but there is one extra step that needs to be done regarding accessing the key on the parallel port. we have a 200 mhz pentium pro/nt and it runs FAST! blew the doors off of a 90 mhz pentium/95 doing place and route on the same netlist. rk ___________________________________________ Hans Tiggeler <ees1ht@ee.surrey.ac.uk> wrote in article <5n8feh$9du@info-server.surrey.ac.uk>... > > Does anybody know how to get Designer Series 3.1 working under NT4.0? Perhaps > too much to ask, what about WorkView Office 7.2 under NT 4.0? > > Thanks, > Hans Tiggeler > >Article: 6628
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Article: 6629
On Thu, 05 Jun 1997 14:29:42 -0700, Pascal Dornier >> Emulation
Technology makes a produces called ChipQuik which consists
>> of a heavy-duty flux and special low-temp alloy. All you have to do
>> is apply the flux to the pins of a part you want to remove and then
>> apply a bead of the alloy, effectively shorting all the leads
>> together. You then heat the PWB from the back-side with a heat gun
>> and pick up the offending device with a vacuum pen. I'm sure an IR
>> rework station would also work. Remove the excess alloy with solder
>> wick and it's ready to go.
>
>A hot air gun is cheaper, and won't leave you with some questionable
>alloy on the pads. I loop some non-insulated wire (26 AWG) under the
>pads of the device, and hold up the board by the wire. When the chip
>gets hot enough, it will come off without board damage.
>
I don't see how the trace amount of alloy left on the pads is a
problem. By the time the pads are wiped off with solder wick, the
amount left will not significantly affect the reflow temperature of
the new solder. Granted, if I am not careful to clean the pads and
the soldering iron the new solder joint will be dull and not
trustworthy. However, done properly the new joint is shiny and
perfect.
I see a couple of disadvantages to the heat gun only approach:
- you need to heat all 4 sides of a QFP at the same time. If you are
using a tip big enough to fully cover the part, it will be very
difficult to get the part hot enough. (I have tried this in the past)
- it is difficult to prevent the reflow of solder on neighbouring
parts
- the temperature required to reflow the solder is same neighbourhood
as the temperature required to soften the glue holding the pads to the
PWB. If the pads lift, type PWB quickly become junk.
- even with a proper IR rework station, it is possible to replace a
part 3-4 times. I don't see that limit with ChipQuik.
- I want to be able to re-use the part after is it removed and not
worry that it was damaged by the heat of the removal process. Using
an IR rework station, the heat is applied only to the pins. I don't
see how you do this with a heat gun.
When I said that I apply a heat gun to the backside of a PWB, I meant
at a low setting. The resulting alloy/solder mix melts at <200 F,
well below the temperature required to do device or PWB damage.
Thanks for your input, but I'm going to keep using ChipQuik.
Garnett
===================Safeguarding the Keys to Electronic Commerce
Garnett Hamilton Chrysalis-ITS, Inc.
Sr H/W Designer 200-380 Hunt Club Rd
Tel.: 613-731-6788 ext 120 Ottawa ON K1C 1V1
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Article: 6630Rhodes, Thanks for a SUPER article. Could you please identify your vendor that does this assembly for you as I want to use them too! In article <5n7f8k$cei$1@nntp2.ba.best.com> rhodes@gigaops.com writes: ... A really GREAT article > >Rhodes Hileman >Director of Manufacturing >GigaOperations Corporation >Berkeley, California >rh@smsys.com >www.gigaops.comArticle: 6631
The original thread of this topic was "FPGA Gate Counting: No truth in
advertising".
Regarding the court case: This is a very complicated issue and because of
the ongoing litigation between Actel and QuickLogic I have no comment to
be presented in this forum. I would prefer to spend my time competing in
the market place and work on growing market share.
Regards,
Ben Blair
Manager Field Applications
QuickLogic Corporation
Disclaimer: The above statements are my own opinions and do not represent
QuickLogic Corporation in any way.
In article <19970605223419410642@1cust5.max2.minneapolis2.mn.ms.uu.net>,
john@customer1st.com (John Sievert) wrote:
>
> Now that you have beat that to death, got anything to say about the
> summary judgement? (My originial topic....) That might actually be
> interesting. ;-)
>
> <Blair@QuickLogic.com> wrote:
>
> > Let me see, you signed your name and your company and your domain and you
> > are in the MN phone book and you supplied your email address, yep you
> > are correct you did supply that information. I just wanted to clarify
> > your identity without users having to search for your name, company,
> > domain, email or the MN phone book in order to be aware of that
> > particular piece of un-obvious information. Now, if that is a personal
> > attack then you are a pretty sensitive kind of guy.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Ben Blair
> > Manager Field Applications
> > QuickLogic Corporation
> >
> > The above comments are my own and in no way express the views of
> > QuickLogic Corporation. (Typical legal disclaimer) :^)
> >
> >
> > In article <19970531210528300253@1cust93.max1.minneapolis2.mn.ms.uu.net>,
> > john@customer1st.com (John Sievert) wrote:
> > >
> > > Nothing hidden here!
> > >
> > > Let me see, I signed my name, my company name is in my domain name, both
> > > my name and my company's name are in the phone book, and the POP I
> > > connected from is listed right in the email. What's wrong with being
> > > the sales engineer here? Aren't you a QL employee? Aren't we all
> > > involved in this industry?
> > >
> > > The issue isn't who works for who, but what's in the summary judgement -
> > > and therefore, who owns what. That isn't mud slinging, its a fact and
> > > now a matter of public record. How is that mud slinging? What's your
> > > problem?
> > >
> > > If you've got something to say on this case, I'd be interested in
> > > hearing it. This court case is complex, but interesting and worthy of
> > > discussion. If you want to make personal attacks, I guess I'd consider
> > > that a waste of time. But, if that's the image you want to project for
> > > you and your company, I guess that's your business.
> > >
> > > Regards
> > > John Sievert
> > > Customer 1st, Inc.
> > >
> > > <Blair@QuickLogic.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > In article <19970526224329123272@cust4.max1.minneapolis.mn.ms.uu.net>,
> > > > john@customer1st.com (John Sievert) wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Technology, which it appears, probably came from Actel (per summary
> > > > > judgement against QuickLogic on patent infringement.).
> > > > >
> > > > > <kevintsmith@compuserve.com> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > In this case, it's not marketing hype, just superior
> > > > > > technology.
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Regards,
> > > > > John Sievert
> > > >
> > > > Aren't you the Actel Manufacturers Rep in the MN area?
> > > >
> > > > It would behoove you to not sling mud and try to hide your identity.
> > > >
> > > > Regards,
> > > > Ben Blair
> > > > Manager Field Applications
> > > > QuickLogic Corporation
> > > >
> > > > -------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
> > > > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Post to Usenet
> > >
> > > --
> > > Regards,
> > > John Sievert
> >
> > -------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
> > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Post to Usenet
>
> --
> Regards,
> John Sievert
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Post to Usenet
Article: 6632On Thu, 05 Jun 1997 09:49:48 +0100, Iakovos Stamoulis <I.Stamoulis@Sussex.ac.uk> wrote: >Alright, but what exactly makes Altera's non-PCI compatible ??? I think I've answered that a few times :-) <snip> > You may be pleased to hear since then, we have >switched to ORCA 2C40s which IMHO are by far >more sophisticated FPGAs/CPLD. What more can I say? A man with impeccable taste. StuartArticle: 6633
In <3397ea75.185165323@client.news.psi.ca>, ghamilton@chrysalis-its.com (Garnett Hamilton) writes: >On 3 Jun 1997 18:56:37 GMT, johnm@Newbridge.COM (John McDougall) >wrote: > >It's quick, easy, and results in ZERO damage to the PWB. If you are >careful you can even re-use the device you are removing. Cost of the >kit is $47Cdn. I can remove a 144-pin TQFP and have the sight clean, >ready for new part, in 10 minutes. Circuit Specialists Inc. (http://www.cir.com) sell this kit for US$18.95. I don't know what the current exhange rate is off the top of my head, it may me a better price. (5 up price is 15.79).Article: 6634
Ivan, Get a copy of the PCI spec either by joining PCI SIG, or getting a copy of Solari 'PCI Hardware and Software', which I highly recommend (available at www.annabooks.com). The easiest PCI tutorial there is is the PCI spec....it is really pretty good! There is no 'simple' PCI interface, you have to do a full target implementation (less target burst...) to be able to do anything (ie, configuration accesses require a fully working target state machine and control logic...) ...that is as simple as it gets. You can leave out parity checking, but you still have to do parity generation... Some CPLD/FPGA manufacturers (I can't name any off the top of my head, or I would...) offer PCI 'design' information....to do a target....and you might want to check their web sites... Bon Chance! Austin Franklin darkroom@ix.netcom.com Ivan Hamer <ivan@caseware.com> wrote in article <3395d321.22329448@news.caseware.com>... > > I would like to make a simple PCI interface card that would allow > me to do some basic I/O with 'outside world'. I found quite some > information about the ISA interfaces, but basically nothing usefull > about PCI. I would be very thankfull if someone could tell me how I > should approach this problem (point me to some resources on net, or > literature). > > Ivan Hamer (ivan.hamer@toronto.edu). >Article: 6635
> Ivan Hamer <ivan@caseware.com> wrote in article > <3395d321.22329448@news.caseware.com>... > > > > I would like to make a simple PCI interface card that would allow > > me to do some basic I/O with 'outside world'. I found quite some > > information about the ISA interfaces, but basically nothing usefull > > about PCI. I would be very thankfull if someone could tell me how I > > should approach this problem (point me to some resources on net, or > > literature). > > > > Ivan Hamer (ivan.hamer@toronto.edu). > > Check out http://www.vcc.com/pci6200.html -- Steve Casselman, President Virtual Computer Corporation http://www.vcc.comArticle: 6636
Steve, I believe you meant: http://www.vcc.com/products/pci6200.html This seems to work...the one you listed below doesn't ;-) Austin Steve Casselman <sc@vcc.com> wrote in article <3399A637.2C3E@vcc.com>... > > Ivan Hamer <ivan@caseware.com> wrote in article > > <3395d321.22329448@news.caseware.com>... > > > > > > I would like to make a simple PCI interface card that would allow > > > me to do some basic I/O with 'outside world'. I found quite some > > > information about the ISA interfaces, but basically nothing usefull > > > about PCI. I would be very thankfull if someone could tell me how I > > > should approach this problem (point me to some resources on net, or > > > literature). > > > > > > Ivan Hamer (ivan.hamer@toronto.edu). > > > > Check out http://www.vcc.com/pci6200.html > -- > Steve Casselman, President > Virtual Computer Corporation > http://www.vcc.com >Article: 6637
rhodes@gigaops.com wrote: > (a short excerpt from an EXCELLENT post): > > Inspection is done under 10x or 20x microscope with a fiberoptic ring lamp. > Using a "probe" (a flexible scribe, or a needle in an Exacto chuck) every pin on the > FPGA is pushed on the side of the foot with about 12-16oz. of pressure. The > probe's flexing can be calibrated against a scale. With a little practice the inspector > can repeatedly produce 14oz, +-1oz, even with his eyes closed. > > This probing reveals solder joints which were inadequately heated, usually by the > reflow oven, occasionally by hand. The joint may look perfect to visual inspection, > with well-sloped fillets all around the foot, but underneath the foot there may be > un-fused solder paste, or no solder. With pressure held on the side of the foot for > 1-2 seconds, the foot in a defective joint will slowly twist or slide off the land. It > does not pop off; it slides as if held by soft fudge. Usually the toe holds best while > the heel lets go. > I wonder if infrared thermal imaging would be of use here. Since electrical conductivity seems to go hand-in-hand with thermal conductivity, if one imaged a cold package on a warm board, leads that were not well connected to the board should appear cooler than leads that had a good solder joint. Since I don't have an IR system to play with (perhaps $10K?), I have no idea of the practicality of this idea, but it seems in principle do-able, at least for isolating potential problem areas that could then be hand-probed. regards, tomArticle: 6638
: > Bharat Kurani (Bharat.Kurani@add.ssw.abbott.com) wrote: : > : I need address/phone/fax list of all semiconductor companines : > : > Then you should be looking in the Thomas Register. Check your local : > library. : > : > : Thank you : > : > : bharat@antrix.com : > : Bharat.Kurani@add.ssw.abbott.com Thomas Reg. on-line at http://noframes.thomasregister.com/loginchk.cgi -- EdDataFix edpaolo@intac.com Scotch Plains, N.J.Article: 6639
Peter wrote: > But if you just want to remove a chip without wanting to re-use it, > hot air is fine. Or just slice the pins off very close to the package with a sharp knife, then nip round and desolder many pins at a time using a biggish tip and a blob of solder. IME, far less likely to kill pads / tracks that way. It also avoids any temptation to re-use the chip. SteveArticle: 6640
hi, i am doing a bit of a study and am trying to collect information on fpga usage. i would first like to break it down by size in "gates" - so i guess you ought to list the manufacturer along with the gate size :-) then i'll also be able to break it down by manufacturer also. feel free to either post or e-mail. i am interested in number of designs, not the number of production units. if you would like to add a description of the application that would be interesting too. i'll collect whatever responses i get, organize them, and post them. thanks for any info, rkArticle: 6641
robert bible wrote:
>
> Everyone designing with FPGAs or CPLDs should stay away from altera if
> they expect a long product life for their design. I am sure that I am
> not the only person who is being burned by the discontinuing production
> of the EPX 880 EPX 8160... Altera is completely irresponsible shutting
> off production with minimal notice. What are we supposed to do. Redesign
> working items in production because Altera refuses to support their
> customers.
>
> Think about what life would be like if all the semiconductor companies
> acted like Altera. I guess they do give EE job security. But I have
> better things to do than migrate designs from one device to another
> because of Altera marketing decisions.
>
> Robert Bible
> San Diego
Altera is really acting no differently than other semi makers. When
demand falls, and technololgy becomes obsolete, they will shut down a
product line. I think even Xilinx is starting to make noise about
obsoleting some of their earlier chips. IC makers are getting more and
more of their revenue from high volume products that have short
production lives. That means those of us with longer-lived products have
little choice but to invest in lifetime buys or plan for redesigns. You
can make the redesign path easier by embracing synthesis and your HDL of
choice.
In the past, Altera was guilty of not being vocal about their
obsolescence plans, but they seemd to get better a year or two ago. The
responsible thing to do would be for Altera (& other IC makers) to post
this info on their web site, send mass mailing announcements to their
customers, and even send press releases to the main Engineering
magazines for inclusion in their "news & notes" sections. They should
also be giving customers at least a 1 year transition zone before last
buys. Has Altera failed to do these things in your case?
There is no shortage of press announcements about the latest & greatest
from these companys, but damn little information about products and
tools that are on their deathbed.
--
=====================================================================
William Lenihan lenihan3we@earthlink.net
"The greatest barrier to communication is the delusion that
it has already occurred." -- Peter Cummings
=====================================================================
Article: 6642Hello, i have a problem with the readback on the xc40xx. has anyone some information to or expierences with this feature ? Andreas Wassatsch -- = # Andreas Wassatsch Tel: +49 (0)381 498 3533 # University Rostock Fax: +49 (0)381 498 1126 # Department of Electrical Engineering # Institute of Applied Microelectronics and Computer Science # Richard-Wagner-Str. 31 # 18119 Rostock-Warnem=FCnde email: wa11@e-technik.uni-rostock.de= # Germany WWW: http://www-md.e-technik.uni-rostock.de/~wa11Article: 6643
Ivan, Wouldn't the best idea be to use a Standard PCI interface IC and then add your FPGA or other logic around that. I'm sure companies like UMC etc manufacture these devices by the millions. It may be cheaper than using an FPGA. I can understand why you would want to use an FPGA though. > > I would like to make a simple PCI interface card that would allow >me to do some basic I/O with 'outside world'. I found quite some >information about the ISA interfaces, but basically nothing usefull >about PCI. I would be very thankfull if someone could tell me how I >should approach this problem (point me to some resources on net, or >literature). > > Ivan Hamer (ivan.hamer@toronto.edu). Gareth BaronArticle: 6644
In article <3395d321.22329448@news.caseware.com>, ivan@caseware.com (Ivan Hamer) writes:
|>
|> I would like to make a simple PCI interface card that would allow
|> me to do some basic I/O with 'outside world'. I found quite some
|> information about the ISA interfaces, but basically nothing usefull
|> about PCI. I would be very thankfull if someone could tell me how I
|> should approach this problem (point me to some resources on net, or
|> literature).
If you don't want to spend more than half a year in designing/testing your own
PCI implementation, try some of-the-shelf chips (maybe there are more...):
S5933 from AMCC (http://www.amcc.com/product-guide/pci/pci.html) and
PCI9060 from PLX (http://www.plxtech.com/overvue.htm)
The PLX PCI9060 has a 'normal' i960-bus, DMA-controllers and some other gimmicks
onchip. The S5933 seems to be what you need (basic IO).
--
Bye
Georg Acher, acher@informatik.tu-muenchen.de
http://www.informatik.tu-muenchen.de/~acher/
"Oh no, not again !" The bowl of petunias
Article: 6645Georg Acher wrote: > > In article <3395d321.22329448@news.caseware.com>, ivan@caseware.com (Ivan Hamer) writes: > |> > |> I would like to make a simple PCI interface card that would allow > |> me to do some basic I/O with 'outside world'. I found quite some > |> information about the ISA interfaces, but basically nothing usefull > |> about PCI. I would be very thankfull if someone could tell me how I > |> should approach this problem (point me to some resources on net, or > |> literature). > > If you don't want to spend more than half a year in designing/testing your own > PCI implementation, try some of-the-shelf chips (maybe there are more...): > > S5933 from AMCC (http://www.amcc.com/product-guide/pci/pci.html) and > PCI9060 from PLX (http://www.plxtech.com/overvue.htm) > > The PLX PCI9060 has a 'normal' i960-bus, DMA-controllers and some other gimmicks > onchip. The S5933 seems to be what you need (basic IO). > -- > Bye > Georg Acher, acher@informatik.tu-muenchen.de > http://www.informatik.tu-muenchen.de/~acher/ > "Oh no, not again !" The bowl of petunias Also try the V3 website http://www.vcubed.com -- Michael J. Kelly tel: (508) 278-9400 fax: (508) 278-9500 web: http://www.cogcomp.comArticle: 6646
In article <339B9E48.1FC6@e-technik.uni-rostock.de>, Andreas Wassatsch <wa11@e-technik.uni-rostock.de> wrote: >Hello, > >i have a problem with the readback on the xc40xx. > >has anyone some information to or expierences with this feature ? Can you describe the problem you are having? One thing to bear in mind is the MAXIMUM readback clock period spec. The latches which hold the readback state are dynamic and suffer bit rot if you shift the data out too slowly. -jeff -- Jeffrey M. Arnold jma@super.org or jmarnold@znet.com 10686 Mira Lago Terrace Tel: 619-547-9257 San Diego, CA 92131 Fax: 619-547-9010 USAArticle: 6647
I'm studying Xilinx information about one of their new parts: the
XC6200. When I saw the architecture, I thought that it was possible to map
only one gate for each cell (they have only one functional unit and each
FU is capable of implementing only one gate). If you look at the table
of characteristics of these FPGAs they say that the XC6216 has 4096
cells (64x64) but the maximum number of logic gates is 24,000
Is there anybody able to explain this to me?
--
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Pedro Merino Gonzalez
Ph. D. Student at Integrated Systems Laboratory (UPM)
mail: E.T.S.I. de Telecomunicacion phone: (+34 1)549-5700 x 420
Dpto. de Ingenieria Electronica fax: (+34 1) 336-7323
Ciudad Universitaria s/n email: merino@die.upm.es
28040 Madrid (Spain) WWW: -> http://betis.die.upm.es/~merino
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Article: 6648Pedro Merino Gonzalez wrote: > > I'm studying Xilinx information about one of their new parts: the > XC6200. When I saw the architecture, I thought that it was possible to map > only one gate for each cell (they have only one functional unit and each > FU is capable of implementing only one gate). If you look at the table Each FU has a 2:1 mux and a flip-flop. One could call the mux 2 gates (average of 1 and 3) and the flip-flop 4 gates, for a total of 24K gates. The Xilinx data sheet says 16,000-24,000 gates, and the 24,000 gate count is the upper limit that will only be infrequently attained. > of characteristics of these FPGAs they say that the XC6216 has 4096 > cells (64x64) but the maximum number of logic gates is 24,000 > > Is there anybody able to explain this to me? > I am sure that both Xilinx and their competitors will respond. There have also been recent newsgroup threads discussing gate-counting methodologies,which I have not researched in writing this response. > -- > /// \\\ > ( ..) (.. ) > --------o00-(_)-00o-----------o00-(_)-00o------------------------------ > Pedro Merino Gonzalez > Ph. D. Student at Integrated Systems Laboratory (UPM) > > mail: E.T.S.I. de Telecomunicacion phone: (+34 1)549-5700 x 420 > Dpto. de Ingenieria Electronica fax: (+34 1) 336-7323 > Ciudad Universitaria s/n email: merino@die.upm.es > 28040 Madrid (Spain) WWW: -> http://betis.die.upm.es/~merino > -----------------------------------------------------------------------Article: 6649
Austin Franklin wrote: > > Steve, > > I believe you meant: > > http://www.vcc.com/products/pci6200.html > > This seems to work...the one you listed below doesn't ;-) > > Austin > > Steve Casselman <sc@vcc.com> wrote in article <3399A637.2C3E@vcc.com>... > > > Ivan Hamer <ivan@caseware.com> wrote in article > > > <3395d321.22329448@news.caseware.com>... > > > > > > > > I would like to make a simple PCI interface card that would allow > > > > me to do some basic I/O with 'outside world'. I found quite some > > > > information about the ISA interfaces, but basically nothing usefull > > > > about PCI. I would be very thankfull if someone could tell me how I > > > > should approach this problem (point me to some resources on net, or > > > > literature). > > > > > > > > Ivan Hamer (ivan.hamer@toronto.edu). > > > > > > Check out http://www.vcc.com/products/pci6200.html > > -- > > Steve Casselman, President > > Virtual Computer Corporation > > http://www.vcc.com > > You are right about the address thing - opps. Our revised board has the feature that you can load the XC4013 dynamicly. There are lots of examples of PCI interfaces around (look at Xilinx app notes for verilog PCI interface using 3000). All the schematics for the HOT Works are included so you can port a design to the XC4013. The board only costs $995 and comes with 2 meg 15ns ram all the software to program the XC6216 and examples along with Hardware Object Technology. To program the XC4013 you would also need the Xact software for the 4000 series devices. -- Steve Casselman, President Virtual Computer Corporation http://www.vcc.com
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